Meet The Pro: Wildlife Photographer - Thomas Nicolon

In this episode, host Toby Jermyn welcomes wildlife photographer and National Geographic Explorer Thomas Nicolon to the Pangolin Podcast. Based in southern France, Thomas shares his experiences documenting the fragile bond between humanity and the natural world, focusing heavily on his work in the Congo Basin. 

In a unique turn for the podcast, Toby and Thomas meet for the first time on air, discussing Thomas's path from journalism to earning National Geographic grants and his future expeditions to the DRC and Cameroon. 

Here is a link to a gallery of Thomas's images: https://pangolin.smugmug.com/SmugMug-Website/Pangolin-Podcast/Thomas-Nicolon/Meet-the-Pro-Thomas-Nicolon

CONNECT WITH THOMAS

• https://www.thomasnicolon.com/
• https://www.instagram.com/thomasnicolon/
• https://www.youtube.com/@thomas.nicolon

Thomas shares four of his own powerful images, including a portrait of the exceptionally old habituated western lowland gorilla, Kingo, taken shortly before his death, and a dramatic shot of a forest elephant at a Congo research camp that later charged his team. He also discusses the logistics of GPS-collaring forest elephants, tips for rainforest photography, and selects an admired sunset giraffe image by David Chancellor as his "guest" photo. 

GUEST IMAGE

Sunset Giraffe by David Chancellor

• https://www.davidchancellor.com/
• https://www.instagram.com/chancellordavid/

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Africa's premier photo safari operator and lodge owner.

Disclaimer: This post contains affiliate links. If you make a purchase, I may receive a commission at no extra cost to you.

Join our growing community of wildlife photography enthusiasts by signing up for the Friday Focus newsletter which Is full of camera gear advice, photo tips, and safari specials around the world. 

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Transcript

Toby: Hello and welcome to another brand new episode of the Pangolin Podcast. I'm your host, Toby Jermyn. Thank you very much for joining me. In each episode, I've invited a professional wildlife photographer to imagine themselves in a remote location. And along with their camera gear, they're allowed to bring five photographs to hang on the wall of their humble dwelling. Now, four of these must be their own, and the final image is one they admire by another photographer. If you're watching this on YouTube, you can see the images as we talk, but for audio listeners on other platforms, there's a link in the description to a gallery. On today's show...

Thomas: I remember the first day I was talking to the vet, like we were doing a brief, and I was like, "What if an elephant charges?" And then he goes, "Well, you know, you just climb a tree." And I was like, "Do I know how to climb a tree? I don't even know. Like, I haven't climbed trees since I was a kid."

Toby: My guest today is a photographer and National Geographic Explorer whose work reveals the delicate bond between people and the natural world. He spent five years based in the Democratic Republic of Congo and specifically the Congo Basin, before moving to Peru for two years to investigate wildlife trafficking in the Amazon. Today he is back in his native France but continues to explore tropical forests around the world, shedding light on the challenges facing our planet's biodiversity. Now, before I introduce him, I have a small confession to make. Every guest that's appeared on the Pangolin Podcast so far, I either know personally, or at the very least have spoken to in preparation for the podcast. This is not the case with today's guest, as we haven't managed to coordinate our diaries to do so. So, in a Pangolin Podcast first, you and I are both about to meet the pro. Welcome to the show, Thomas Nicolon. Hello, bonjour, Thomas.

Thomas: Hi, Toby. Thank you for having me. Bonjour. It's a pleasure to do this with you.

Toby: Well, this is, as I said, a real novelty as well, because you reached out to me and said, "Look, I've really enjoyed the podcast, and I've got these amazing stories and images to tell about the Congo. Would you consider having me on the show?" And I wrote back, I think, very quickly saying, "Absolutely, let's get you on." But like ships in the night, we have failed catastrophically to catch up before. So, Thomas, very nice to meet you.

Thomas: Very nice to meet you, Toby.

Toby: And where do we find you today? You've got a small piece of jungle behind you, but you're not in the jungle. Whereabouts are you today?

Thomas: So I'm at home in southern France. I try to keep a bit of the jungle with me at all times, but it's pretty sad. It's pretty sad looking. But yeah, I'm in southwestern France to be precise. I'm close to the city of Bordeaux. So at least when I'm not in the field, I can enjoy nice wine and cheese.

Toby: Well, yes, I think maybe that's what keeps you going on some of those lonely nights out in the rainforest. The dream of delicious wine and cheeses going forward. So, what's next for you? Where are you off to next? Have you got plans?

Thomas: Yeah, actually, I have a lot of plans this year. It should be a busy year. Off to the DRC next. And I'm very excited because as you said in the intro, I was based in the DRC for five years from 2015 to 2020, but I haven't been since 2020. So I'm actually a bit emotional about going back, especially with what's going on in the East with the conflict. There's a lot going on, a lot that has changed, and I'm also scheduled to go to Cameroon after that and Gabon as well.

Toby: Wow. And is there anything specific? Obviously, you are a National Geographic Explorer. Is this a Nat Geo project you're going to work on? How long are you there for? Tell us what you're up to.

Thomas: Well, actually, I do a lot of work for other media outlets and also for conservation NGOs. So the next few trips involve the Wildlife Conservation Society. They have a lot of projects in the Congo Basin, in the DRC and Cameroon as well. So I have a few assignments planned with them.

Toby: I'm sure we're definitely going to talk as we go along about more of your conservation work. But I'm eager to get stuck into the photographs. So tell us, let's start with the first photograph. And will you please tell the viewers and listeners about this photograph and why you chose it?

Thomas: It's one of my favourite photos. It's a forest elephant in a small stream in the middle of the rainforest, and the elephant is staring right at me. And I remember this moment very vividly because I was staying in a research camp in a national park in northern Congo called Nouabalé-Ndoki National Park, and it's run by the Wildlife Conservation Society, actually, and Congo Wildlife Authorities hand in hand. And there's a research site in the middle of this national park where they study gorillas. The research site is like three huts in the middle of the rainforest protected by an electrical fence because they have a lot of forest elephants there. And forest elephants are very different from savanna elephants. It's a completely different species; it's critically endangered, and it's slightly smaller, and they're way more aggressive. They charge very easily, they get startled and scared easily too, because they have very bad eyesight. So in the rainforest, every time they hear something or they smell something, they just charge. And actually, people get killed every year in Central Africa by forest elephants. And one morning we were just waking up, and this elephant was just drinking in that stream by the research station. And because the visibility was okay for that elephant, because it was not obstructed by branches or anything, it was pretty chill, and I was able to take these photos. I'm not very far from it. I'm using a 300mm lens on this one, and it was quite calm. But then later that day we went to the forest to follow gorillas. And at some point we took a break to have lunch. So we found a nice spot in the rainforest to sit and have lunch far from the gorillas. And as we were finishing lunch, I hear a branch break behind me, just a small branch, a small crack. And I turn around and there's this elephant right in my face. I yelled, "nzoku," which means elephant in Lingala, and we all started running. And let me tell you, I left all my gear right there on the forest floor. I had like maybe 20,000 euros worth of gear lent by Canon for that assignment. I just did not have time to pick up my bag. I had to run. Like everybody knows in the rainforest of Central Africa, you see an elephant, you assess the distance, and either you hide behind a tree, but when it's that close, you just run. You don't ask any questions, you run. And that elephant, he charged us for 20 minutes, and it just wouldn't stop. We were running for our lives in the middle of the rainforest with branches and lianas and everything. And that's the same elephant that you see in this picture that we saw in the morning. And according to the biologists who were there with me, the elephant had been following us all day. We just didn't realize it. And probably what happened, it's such a remote area, it had never seen humans. And it was just super curious and wondering who we were and what we were doing there. And basically, he followed us in silence the whole day until he just decided to chase us, and we were all traumatized after running for 20 minutes, and we just went back to camp and called it a day.

Toby: You know what? You think it's being really aggressive. Maybe it just wanted to be friends.

Thomas: That's what we thought too! And the thing is, for a long while, while it was charging us, it was not making any sounds. It was just following us, and we would turn around and, damn, it's still here, and we would keep running. And then towards the end, he started the trumpeting and stuff. But anyway, it was thrilling and terrifying. And I'm glad I have photos of this beautiful young male.

Toby: It's a lovely, lovely photograph because obviously, with the terrain that you're photographing in, forest elephants are often obscured. So to have a clear shot with the ears extended as well... That's really, really unique. And in water, really cool.

Thomas: Yeah, I really like this image. It might not be my best, but it takes me back to that moment. And by the way, I have a YouTube channel where I put the behind-the-scenes of my assignment, and there is a video from that assignment in the Congo, and you see more footage of that same elephant in the morning when it was just drinking in that stream.

Toby: There we go. I think you should rename the video to "The Congo's Friendliest Elephant." Try to accuse it of chasing you down when it just wanted to be friends! So tell us a bit about the project there. So you're in a research station. What was the reason you were there? You said it was gorillas, or was it other things as well?

Thomas: Yeah, actually, just for context, this is the Republic of Congo. This is not the Democratic Republic of Congo. And in the north, you have this beautiful national park called Nouabalé-Ndoki National Park. And it's one of the last forest elephant strongholds in Central Africa, but also Western lowland gorillas and chimps as well. And I was there for the Wildlife Conservation Society. I spent six weeks in the national park taking photos of wildlife, landscapes, but also the staff at work, the rangers. So, for that photo, like I said, I was in a research station called Mondika, and over there they follow three groups of gorillas on a daily basis and they study them. They take notes on their behaviour, everything, and it's been going on since the 90s. And the trackers, actually, they're there with us, not only to find the gorillas every day, but also to warn us of the presence of elephants, because you're not allowed to go in the forest without trackers. It's too dangerous because of the elephants. It's one of the wildest places on the planet. Like you literally go to sleep, you go to your tent, you hear gorillas chest-beating, you hear elephants trumpeting. It's really, really remote. I can only recommend to go check it out.

Toby: Well, is there tourism? Are there locations for people to go and visit if they want to visit this national park? I think people are always wanting to go and see more remote places that other people haven't seen and photographed as well. But that's balanced out with a level of risk that they're prepared to take. Is this somewhere that you would recommend for somebody to go if they want to go and see these animals?

Thomas: Yeah, I absolutely recommend it because when most people think of Africa and African wildlife, they think of the savanna. And you're in the back of the truck with your long lens and you just stop whenever you see an animal. But Central Africa gives you a totally different experience. You're in the rainforest, you have to trek, you have a heavy backpack, and you just bump into animals. It's not like you have the protection of a car or anything. So it's really something different, something unique. And you can be quite close to some animals, especially great apes. And yes, you can go to Nouabalé-Ndoki National Park in Northern Congo as a tourist. It's not maybe the level of luxury that you can get in some Kenyan or Tanzanian lodges. It's a bit more of an adventure, and you also have other national parks that can accommodate tourists, of course.

Toby: Well, there we go. That's now on the list, I think, for myself and for several other people. So I'll let you know when we're gonna go and we'll see you there. I think we could talk for hours about this one because it's such an amazing ecosystem. But let's move on to the second image before we get carried away. I think this is gonna be a two-hour podcast at this rate. Tell us about this beautiful, beautiful image. It's a lovely, lovely portrait.

Thomas: Okay, I love this photo for one specific reason. This is a photo of Kingo, a silverback Western lowland gorilla in Nouabalé-Ndoki National Park, in that same national park. And I'm so happy I have this photo because this is towards the end of Kingo's life. Kingo was the oldest gorilla studied by scientists. They started following him in the 90s, and he was, when I photographed him, between 45 and 50 years of age, which is very old for a gorilla. And he did not have any females anymore in his group. He was only surrounded by young males, and he was always lagging behind. And you can see that he looks quite old, and he was a piece of history because he had been followed and studied by scientists since the 90s, basically. And for those who don't know, the way biologists study gorillas is they habituate them to the presence of the biologist, and they go see them every day. And at first, obviously, the gorillas are quite aggressive and scared and they run away, but every day, little by little, after a few months, the group is what we call habituated. And Kingo was the oldest habituated gorilla in all of Africa, actually. And maybe three, four months after this photo was taken, he died. So that was pretty sad. That's Kingo.

Toby: Well, I love the story, and I do know what I really enjoy. The fact that you took the brief of selecting images with real meaning to you. I'm sure you have a massive portfolio, but I'm very glad you've taken the brief to heart and chosen the images that have so much meaning to you. So there we go. Tick that box.

Thomas: I thought long and hard about the photos that would have a nice story behind them.

Toby: It's a real challenge for people to narrow it down to four images. Let's talk technical because there's a lot of people watching this who will perhaps not go to Congo, but might go to Rwanda, Uganda, places like that where they want to go and see gorillas. And it's very challenging photography. You've got a very dark subject in dappled light. What have you learnt in your time in the rainforest as either go-to settings or ways that you approach photography like this so you're not missing the moment by messing around with your settings?

Thomas: Yeah, that's a great question. And actually, the first thing I learned—and I don't want to sound cliché—but it's patience. Because in the rainforest, when you're following a group of gorillas, or it can be bonobos and chimps, or whatever you're photographing, you don't choose the terrain. The animal that you're following does. And sometimes, the whole day, the group of gorillas is gonna be in dark undergrowth behind trees and branches, and you're not gonna be able to take one good photo. So it is challenging, and you have to wait for them to be in a nice spot. And yeah, for rainforest photography, first of all, you need a 2.8 aperture. It's rare that I take a photo of a gorilla at f/4, for example, because you just need that extra light, and your shutter speed is always quite low as well. And you also always have branches and leaves in between you and the subject, and it's really hard to have that clean shot. It's really tough. So when you get one good photo, you're really happy, and obviously, sometimes it's maddening.

Toby: Yeah, often it's overcast as well. I've spoken to several people actually saying that when you go at times when there is more of a propensity for cloud cover, it's slightly easier because you don't have that harsh, dappled light. It's a little bit more diffused. Is there a particular time that you want to go to the rainforest on an expedition like this, or is it "I'll go whenever I can"?

Thomas: That's also a very good question. The rainy season brings, for sure, heavy clouds, and it's true that it diffuses the light a little more. It's true that in the dry season you have harsher light, and also you have that haze, but overall, I would say that the rainy season is better. It's also better, in my opinion, because when it rains, the forest is more alive and you have more wildlife observations. So, yeah.

Toby: There we go. Top tip. And you mentioned 2.8 lenses, so you shoot with Canon, right?

Thomas: I do, yes. And I'm very grateful. Shout out to Canon friends because they help me a lot with gear.

Toby: Even if you did desert it in the forest. Did you manage to get that camera gear back? You said you ran off for 20 minutes, but then did you circle back and get the gear at least?

Thomas: Yeah, actually, when we stopped running, I was like, "I need to go get my camera." And two of the trackers said, "No, no, no, you're not going back out there. It's too dangerous." They prevented me from going back. So they went actually, and I was waiting anxiously, and the bag was intact. The elephant literally walked past it but didn't touch it.

Toby: Oh, yeah. I like the idea that if they went back, and there's the elephant just waiting, thinking, "They'll come back! This'll be great." In the time when you're not being chased by elephants, have you got any top tips to try and protect your gear? Obviously, it's very wet and it's very wet everywhere. It's not just the rain. Have you got any top tips for protecting your gear in these environments?

Thomas: Yeah, actually, that's something I was about to say about the rainy season. It's better, but it's also way more challenging for humidity. So the number one thing is try to use gear that's weather-sealed as much as possible. And also, every night I put my gear in a Peli case or in an airtight container with silica gel in it to absorb all the potential humidity. And careful though, because if you put gear that has water or drops of water on it in a Peli case, then that humidity gets stuck in there and it's even worse. So it's not easy, but yeah, that's what I can recommend.

Toby: There we go. Silica gel and Pelican cases. It's a good advert for Pelican. There we go. Right, we're gonna take a quick break, but before we do take a quick break, I would like to invite all of you listeners to sign up for our world-famous Friday Focus newsletter from Pangolin Photo Safaris. So it's a newsletter, obviously, it goes out by its name every Friday. And in there we've got photo tips, gear advice, safari advice, all sorts of things. So there'll be a QR code on your screen now. You can scan that, or there's a link in the description down below. You can sign up for the Friday Focus newsletter. Right, so we'll be back after this quick break. Welcome back to part two of the Pangolin Podcast with my guest today, Thomas Nicolon from France, Nat Geo Explorer. Let's dive into your third image, shall we? And then whilst we do that, I want to touch on your role as a Nat Geo Explorer.

Toby: So, first of all, tell the viewers and listeners about this wonderfully moody photograph.

Thomas: This photo is linked to another wonderful memory. This is a group of forest elephants in a forest clearing in Dzanga-Sangha in the Central African Republic. The Central African rainforest has a lot of clearings in it that we call "bais." And in these bais, elephants gather to get the minerals from the water and from the ground, and they come to socialise as well. And this is the largest, most famous bai in Central Africa. It's called Dzanga Bai, and there's a wooden platform, a hide, where you can spend the night. And I actually went a few times, but that was the first time I slept there, and this is surreal. Everybody who's into wildlife should do this at some point in their lives. You go sleep on that platform, it's like maybe 10 meters up the ground, and you sleep there in a small tent, and you hear the elephants coming and going and vocalising the whole night. The atmosphere is insane. And then you wake up in the morning and you see this. You see a few elephants walking around in the mist, and this feeling that you're at the beginning of the world, and I just love this photo for this reason because every time I look at it, I just want to go back.

Toby: It's a lovely image. Well, I know you, obviously we've just met, so we've never had this conversation before. But Rod Cassidy is up there. Were you there staying in Sangha with Rod?

Thomas: Actually, no, I never slept at his lodge, I slept at the other. There's basically two accommodation options over there. The other one is run by WWF. And actually, this image is taken quite close to the other images we've looked at earlier because it's the same rainforest, and you have what they call the Sangha Triangle, and you have at the border with the intersection of Congo, Central African Republic, and Cameroon, you have three protected areas. You have Lobéké National Park in Cameroon, Dzanga-Sangha in Central African Republic, and Nouabalé-Ndoki in the Congo, and it's the same thick Central African tropical rainforest, and it's the best place on the planet.

Toby: I've been meaning to go and see Rod. For those of you who don't know Rod Cassidy, he's an amazing conservationist, he's a real pioneer. And if you really fancy an adventure, reach out to Rod. It's one of the things that's on our list of products we want to develop with Pangolin. Thomas, maybe you'd like to come along with us. Maybe that would be an opportunity.

Thomas: I would love that. I always want to go.

Toby: Brilliant. Before we talk more about this image, tell me about your role as the Nat Geo Explorer. Let's go back to the beginning. Did you study photography? Did you do other types of photography before you got this gig?

Thomas: Okay, so in a nutshell, I studied English at university. And I started off as a teacher. I lived in Australia for a year to be a teacher's assistant. Then I lived in Bolivia, where I was an English teacher in a school in La Paz. And then I went back to France to study journalism. I always knew that I wanted to be in photography, in the wild, but I just didn't know how to get there. And in my mind, journalism was a way to approach what I wanted to do. And after two years of journalism school, I joined a news channel called France 24. And I joined as an intern. And basically every day I went to see the guy in charge of foreign correspondence. And I told him, "Send me somewhere. I want to go somewhere." And one day, finally, he looked at me and he went, "Do you want to go to Kinshasa?" And I said, "Yes, I want to go to Kinshasa." I never thought I would end up in Africa. It was never like a goal for me in my career, but I was like, "Yeah, of course, I want a new adventure. I want something new." And I ended up in Kinshasa assisting the correspondent of the news channel. And then after six months, he left and I became the correspondent. And I stayed there for five years. And little by little, on the side, I started doing what I had always wanted to do, which was conservation, wildlife. I funded my first trips, my first stories, and then little by little I got gigs and stuff like that. And eventually, after seven years or so, I left the channel to focus on conservation photography.

Toby: And at what point did National Geographic come in? I mean, National Geographic is really the pinnacle that people try to achieve status on working for them, producing content for them. So, how did that come about?

Thomas: Of course, there are a million ways that a photographer can end up working with Nat Geo. We all have our own path, our own career, etc. So I'm gonna tell you how it happened for me. Simply, short version: I applied for a National Geographic grant. Basically, at National Geographic, you have the magazine and you have the Society. The Society gives out grants. And if you get a grant from the National Geographic Society, you become a National Geographic Explorer. So I got my first grant in 2019, and that's what I did. I applied with a project on the snake bite crisis in Africa because snake bite envenomation is a neglected tropical disease that kills a lot of people in Africa every year, and that's how it started for me. And then the story ended up in the magazine, etc. etc.

Toby: So do you come up with the idea and you say, "This is a story I want to tell, I need a grant to fulfill this"? There isn't a list of things that National Geographic is looking for?

Thomas: Okay. You have different kinds of grants. It's not only for photographers and journalists; it's also for biologists, for example, or archaeologists. So it depends what kind of work you do. And for some grants, there is no topic or area; you can just apply with whatever you want. Like, "I want to have this project on bears in Eastern Europe or whatever." But for some of the grants, you have a specific area. Like, I remember Nat Geo, at some point they had this tropical rainforest grants, a call for proposals: tropical rainforests. And it depends on what they want. You go to their webpage, there should be a new cycle of grants announced at some stage. So, yeah, and then you prepare the whole project. Like, it's a long process to apply to the grant, and it's very selective, very competitive. It's a long process, but it's worth it.

Toby: It's an amazing publication, amazing society as well. Let's go back to the image. So you're sleeping out on a deck, you've heard the animals all night, but is it animals coming and going from these open areas during the day? Did you spend the whole day there?

Thomas: Yeah, I spent a couple of days on that deck, and it's interesting because these clearings, these bais, all around the Central African rainforest, they're usually smaller than this, and usually forest elephants don't really use them in broad daylight because they're pretty skittish and they like the night much better. They like the darkness. But over there, in Dzanga Bai, you have them all day long, sometimes over 70 elephants at a time. It's quite something. They come from far away to use that bai, and they play, they drink, they eat, they socialise. It's amazing.

Toby: It's very beautiful. We could talk forever about these ones, but let's move on to your final image, please. And this is very much more reportage, I would say, using my limited French.

Thomas: I would say that this image is one of my favourites as well, because it's something that I had never documented before. So here we see a group of men around an elephant that's lying in water in the rainforest. And last year, in August, I was very fortunate to go document a GPS collaring operation on forest elephants in Conkouati-Douli National Park in the Republic of Congo on the coast. And this is the first elephant that the vet, Harvey, darted that day. And darting forest elephants, it's one of the most exciting things I've documented, but one of the most terrifying as well. Because, like I said, forest elephants are very tricky. So basically, what happens is we're in the forest, and the trackers—again, we had one tracker called Mambiotto, he's the best in Central Africa—he walks ahead of the group and he tries to spot elephant tracks, and then we follow. And once we found the elephant, the vet, Harvey, needs a clean window to dart. And once he darts the elephant, this is the first tricky moment because either the elephant runs in the opposite direction or it comes charging us. So we have to be ready to climb a tree at all times, because if the elephant comes towards us, the safest thing to do is to climb a tree. In that case, he darted the elephant, the elephant went running the opposite direction, and then you start following the elephant, you start running after the elephant because you have about 20 minutes before the elephant falls to the ground asleep. But you need to be there, you need to find it because otherwise it can die. Because if it falls in the water, for example, with the trunk in the water, then it can die. And also, as soon as the vet finds the elephant on the floor, he injects an antidote. And then he has about 40–45 minutes to attach the collar that you can see on the photo. And once the collar is on the elephant, he injects another antidote that's gonna wake up the elephant. But before he does that, he tells us to go find a tree and hide. So that's what we do. Everybody goes find a tree or something, or sometimes just behind a tree that looks safe enough, and he injects the antidote and the elephant wakes up and hopefully doesn't come our way. But you know, it's funny because I remember the first day I was talking to the vet, like we were doing a brief, and I was like, "What if an elephant charges?" And then he goes, "Well, you know, you just climb a tree." And I was like, "Do I know how to climb a tree? I don't even know. Like, I haven't climbed trees since I was a kid." But then I can tell you it comes naturally when you have an elephant coming.

Toby: You just climb it, it all comes flooding back to you. The techniques that you use as a child. It's like, "Oh yes, I know exactly how that works."

Thomas: Exactly.

Toby: And which organization was this for that you didn't...?

Thomas: So this was for the French NGO that runs that national park in collaboration with Congo Wildlife Authorities. The NGO is called Noé. And the reason they collar the elephants is to be able to track them and know how much they move and where they go, and it helps them understand forest elephants better.

Toby: And when you're doing this, you're running around, you could be walking very long distances. You've got to carry all your gear with you. Do you have an assistant, somebody to help you out? Are you on your own? How much gear can you carry in the rainforest if it's just you?

Thomas: It really depends on the assignment. For example, here in Conkouati, I had a guide that you can see on the right-hand side of the photo. His name is Borja, and he was basically with me the whole time. So he helped me a little bit carrying some stuff from time to time. But for that specific collaring operation, what happened was we first started on a boat. So it was quite easy to transport everything, and then we had like a two, three-hour walk to where we set up camp. So every day I could leave most of my gear in camp and just keep what was really gonna be necessary to keep with me for the day documenting the darting operation. But it depends. Sometimes I don't have an assistant, and that means I have to always figure out what I really need or what lens I can leave behind, or "Do I need this lens? Ah, it's gonna make the backpack heavier." But if I do need it at some point, it's gonna make a difference. And it's... I hate this. I hate having to decide which lenses to leave behind.

Toby: So, what's the first body and lens that you pack that you know you're going to use?

Thomas: Well, at the moment, it's the Canon R1. I've been using it for over a year now. I could talk about it for a long time, but basically three reasons. I like it. First of all, the ergonomics. It's quite big and it fits perfectly in the hands, and it's very comfortable to use. And then, of course, the weather sealing; it's the best weather sealing you can think of, which is very important for me, like we said. And then finally the low-light performance. So I always, always bring the R1. And lens, what's your first lens that you pack? For photojournalism, my main lens is the 28-70mm f/2. It's a big lens, it's heavy, but it's one of the best zoom lenses ever made. You almost get the quality of a prime lens, and the wide aperture too means it's very good to use in the rainforest. So that's always my main lens that I'm gonna use for basically the people stuff or what you see in this image. And then I have all the rest. I have for wildlife a 400mm f/2.8. Right now I have the 100-300mm f/2.8, which I can't wait to use it in the DRC, and I have the 70-200mm as well, and I always take the 100mm macro, always, always, because one thing about me is I'm obsessed with snakes, and so I always take time to look for snakes when I'm on assignment. And most snakes are meant to be photographed with a 100mm macro, so I always bring it with me, but then sometimes I take portrait lenses like a 50mm or an 85mm. Anyway, my backpack is usually pretty heavy.

Toby: That sounds like you need an assistant. So I'm going to volunteer. Bella, the producer, has just said in the chat that she is definitely going to come, she will carry the camera bag, not a problem. She is a journalist herself, she can write everything for you. She speaks French. I'm just taking a pitch! I'm taking a pitch. But not until we've recorded a few more of these, please, Bella. Thank you very much. Okay. Honestly, this is going to be very difficult for her to edit, so let's try and move on. Okay, we are going to take another quick break. Before we do, though, it's a reminder to please subscribe to the channel. Also, I'm gonna leave a link to Thomas's channel as well. Go and subscribe to that one so you can keep up with his adventures in the DRC. Please like the video, make some comments. Thomas, I'm sure, will jump onto the comments as well. But we're gonna be right back with the fifth image in this podcast. See you in a minute.

Toby: Welcome back to the final part of the Pangolin Podcast with my guest today, Thomas Nicolon from France. Thomas, we've reached the stage of the show where I've asked you to choose an image taken by another photographer who you admire, maybe an image that you wish you'd taken yourself. So would you please tell the listeners and the viewers about this one?

Thomas: I chose this image by David Chancellor of two giraffes walking in the sunset in the savanna with birds following them. I'm not good with birds, I don't know which species that is, but obviously David is a wonderful photographer, he's such an inspiration. And this one I love so much, and one of the reasons I love it so much is, as we said, I work in the rainforest most of the time. I don't get light. Never. I never get this. Why don't I get this? It's so beautiful. This late afternoon light, the giraffes, their movement. It's just the kind of photos that I wish I had more opportunities to take. And obviously, also giraffes. I never see giraffes. That would be quite surprising in the rainforest, but yeah, it's a gorgeous image.

Toby: I think that would make the cover of National Geographic if you have a giraffe walking through the rainforest! I should keep looking. Keep going. Well, there's an open invitation for you to come and visit us in Botswana. We've got lots and lots of giraffes down there. We also have glorious sunsets. So just to get your vitamin D in, get you out of the rainforest to get some vitamin D going in you. I love the fact, again, you've taken the brief on the images to heart and taken something which you wish you'd taken yourself. But it's more about you wish you were just in the sunlight. There you go. Thomas, thank you very much for being on the show. It's been a real pleasure. Well, firstly, to meet you and have a chat. And we're gonna have to have more chats when you're back from your next expedition. But before we let you go, we always ask the question of our guests. You know, at the top of the show, I said, "Okay, you've got to hang these pictures on the wall of your humble dwelling, but you get to choose where that humble dwelling is." So please tell us, where would you like to live and work and photograph in perpetuity?

Thomas: Okay, it's actually an easy question. I would definitely choose the Central African rainforest. Surprise, surprise. I love the rainforest. It's my favourite habitat. I complain about the light and all that, but it's still my favourite place. You can feel it's just that wildlife is thriving there, and the diversity of mammals and birds and reptiles and amphibians. And if I could have a nice house in either Nouabalé-Ndoki National Park in northern Congo or Conkouati-Douli, where I took that image of the elephant collaring operation that we talked about, I would love that. I leave my house, I'm in the middle of the rainforest, there are elephants walking around, I can go see gorillas, I can photograph snakes. Yeah, it's just happiness. That's my place.

Toby: There we go. And that came as exactly zero surprise to me. I've only known you for the best part of an hour, and I knew you were going to say that. So there we go. Thomas, thank you so much, and I'm so glad we had a chance to do this. Thank you very much for reaching out to me. If anyone else is watching this and you have stories like Thomas's to tell, please get in touch with us. We'd love to hear your stories as well. I'm gonna let you go. You've obviously got to go, you've got to go pack, get ready for another expedition, and then I'm hoping that we can try and find a way to get you to come to Botswana, come and make a video about the experience with us.

Thomas: I would love to do that. Let's work on that, but thank you so much. It was so much fun. I really enjoyed it. Thank you for having me, Toby.

Toby: Thank you for joining me on another episode of the Pangolin Podcast. I hope you enjoyed it as much as I did. As always, we'd love to hear your comments and feedback. So please do leave them in the comments down below. And if you're an audio listener, we'd love it if you could give us a star rating or a quick review. If you don't want to miss the next episode or any of the other wildlife photography videos we make, make sure you subscribe to this channel. Finally, don't forget to sign up to the Pangolin Photo Safari's Friday Focus newsletter. You can do that by heading over to pangolinphoto.com or you can scan the QR code on your screen now. I very much look forward to seeing you on a Pangolin Photo Safari soon. And all that's left for me to say is that the Pangolin Podcast was hosted by me, Toby Jermyn, and produced and edited by Bella Falk. Thank you.